Brand Revelation
Like it or not your brand is probably dealing disappointment to loyal followers and consumers who want to join your team.
LIVE from the base of the Canadian Rocky Mountains in Banff, Chad & Cheese bring you The Gathering onstage including:
Yeti -- Bill Neff, VP Consumer Marketing
Intel -- Allyn Bailey, Talent Acquisition Transformation Leader
Intel -- Tyler Weeks, Head of HR Data Science
A mind-broadening experience you will NOT want to miss all thanks to SmashFly, Let SmashFly help activate your brand and keep relationships at the heart of your CRM. For more information, visit smashfly.com today.
PODCAST TRANSCRIPTION sponsored by:
Joel:
This Chad & Cheese Cult Brand podcast is supported by SmashFly, recruiting technology built for the talent life cycle and big believers in building relationships with brands, not jobs. Let SmashFly help tell your story and keep relationships at the heart of your CRM. For more information, visit SmashFly.com today.
The Gathering:
Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome to the stage bad-ass podcast hosts of Chad & Cheese Podcast, Joel Cheesman and Chad Sowash.
Chad:
I know it's early Canada, but come on, give it up. Come on. Good morning. Who was out till 1:00 AM last night?
Joel:
Nice.
Chad:
Nice.
Joel:
Nice.
Chad:
That's dedication right there.
Joel:
Actually it was someone on our panel who was up till 1:00 AM last night. That's how talent acquisition parties, baby.
Chad:
Yeah, hard. I'm Chad.
Joel:
I'm Cheese, and we are the Chad & Cheese Podcast. Most of you probably don't know who we are. We cover the talent acquisition, HR, marketing more and more, topics on our show. If you listen to podcasts, we invite you to go search whatever podcast platform you enjoy the most, type in Chad, Cheese or any combination of the two, subscribe. If you're not into podcasts in that way, go to chadcheese.com to find out more.
Chad:
Yeah. Can we get our slide? We have one slide.
Joel:
We've got to be on brand here, people.
Chad:
Yes. One slide.
Joel:
We're at a marketing conference.
Chad:
Real quick, gathering story. Everybody has their gathering story, right? Last year, I get this cryptic email, and it's like I have no clue what the hell these guys.
Joel:
Was it from Russia?
Chad:
I have no clue who this guy, no, close. No clue what this guy wants. So I'm like, "Can we talk?" So we get on the phone and he's like, "I want you to come to the gathering. I want you to become a part of the cult." I'm like, "My mom always said not to be a part of a cult." And he's like, "No, seriously. I think your mom is probably a really great woman, but come and join the cult."
Joel:
I'll vouch for your mom.
Chad:
Thanks. We came and we had an amazing experience and we really felt like fish out of water because we are HR, TA. I have 20 years of experience. I was with Monster before it was Monster. Right? So, on the tech side, on the HR side, talent acquisition, I've been an individual contributor. I've also been a leader of teams, actually marketing were reporting up into me. Built veteran hiring programs for some of the biggest brands in the world. Pipelining veterans, military veterans into their organization. And now I'm a duet.
Joel:
And aren't you a lucky man because you're now folically less challenged than you were before. Yeah, both of us have 20 plus years in the industry. So we like to think we know what we're talking about from that perspective. I've worked at Job Boards a little less well known than Monster. I'm an entrepreneur, so I've started and sold companies in the space over the course of my career. Well Known blog at one point called Cheese Said, and now I do the podcast. Surprisingly 85% of my time is through that. So it's been a real surprise success for me as well as I have a startup that helps monitor online employment reviews.
Chad:
So we want to thank the gathering. We want to thank Ryan for that crazy ass cryptic email, first off. Chris, for actually having a conversation saying, "Why the hell are we bringing these guys in?" And then really starting to form this idea between a blind spot that marketing actually has. M marketing, even cult brands. We'll talk about it today. Even cult brands who have been awarded have a blind spot. And for us it's not a blind spot, it's our every damn day.
Chad:
So we're excited to actually bring some guests on stage who can help us talk a little bit further, not just about the HR side of the house, but also bringing the marketing, the consumer base, all of that backend and that blind spot from now on, hopefully, especially here at the gathering. And if you listen to the Cult Brand series from Chad and Cheese, it won't be a blind spot anymore.
Joel:
And I think to add to that, one of the things that we saw in coming to this was that everyone that goes on stage that's a keynote speaker, anyone that goes on to present talks about people. People are our greatest asset. Our brand starts with people. They're our front lines. They're the ones that are out waving the flag to the world. But yet there's a disconnect we think in terms of the recruiting process and how you guys reach out to candidates and appeal to candidates in the process. That's a real disconnect to what your brand is.
Joel:
So part of our relationship with the gathering, and Chris, I think you'll agree with this, is to say, how do we bring recruiting and marketing together? Because they have a lot more in common than you think. So we're real excited to have this presentation this morning to bring a great consumer brand and their marketing as well as some talent acquisition folks, some great brands. So without any further ado, I'd say we bring them to the stage and get this show started.
Chad:
Yep.
Joel:
Let's start with Allyn Bailey from Intel. Let's cheer it for Allyn. She's a little company, she's going salsa dancing after this presentation. So was that what you were wearing last night by the way?
Allyn:
No.
Joel:
Okay, so she's freshened up and ready to go.
Joel:
Nice.
Joel:
Next up is Tyler Weeks from Intel as well. Let's give it up everybody.
Chad:
So we had a challenge, I think about a month ago. So Bill, Joel and I already had facial hair and we said, "Hey, we're all going to grow a beard." And Tyler tried.
Joel:
Let's agree not to shave for a month.
Chad:
He really tried.
Joel:
And this is what we got from Tyler.
Chad:
Put your hands together for Tyler.
Joel:
He's going to be late for school today, unfortunately. And last but not least, you all know I'm Bill Neff, Yeti.
Chad:
Okay. So those are our guests. And I have to say that they're brave because we have many CEOs who won't even come onto this show, because we ask the questions that need to be asked, that aren't asked. We don't generally do the softball question and that's why people listen. They want the reality. They want to know what is going on and that's why we do it. I really appreciate it. Put your hands together for everybody, first off, before we-
Joel:
And Chad, we almost forgot the most important part.
Chad:
Oh yeah.
Joel:
We need to give some thanks. Big thanks to the gathering. Chris is here. Everyone that's great. SmashFly in particular for having the faith not ever being here. They kind of [crosstalk 00:06:47] put out a word at least this here for SmashFly, Stephanie Talent. So we want to give a special thanks to them-
Chad:
And Gina.
Joel:
... and Gina. Yes. Sorry, Gina. For supporting this effort and believing in us and getting a this thing together. Without any further ado.
Chad:
First question, hard question one that I want everybody to listen to very intently. Allyn Bailey, I always pick out on the land and that's why she sat way down there because I always pick on-
Allyn:
I know, I was like far away as I can.
Joel:
And we know that she can take it.
Chad:
So how many human beings actually apply for jobs at Intel in a year's time frame?
Allyn:
A little over 1.5 million.
Chad:
1.5 million. Okay, so Bill, how many people... Okay, so Bill on the consumer side, right?
Joel:
Marketing side.
Chad:
Marketing side. And then we've got the talent acquisition side over here. So they should know their shit. Keyword should. We don't expect Bill to, But bill, do you know how many?
Bill:
No.
Joel:
So there's your first takeaway Marketing folks. Go to HR and ask how many people are applying because why? That could be customers that are coming through the door every day and you're not even conscious of them.
Chad:
So back to Allyn and Tyler. Tyler is the analytics guy. So he generally has all the numbers. So Tyler, do you know how many people actually hit your career site a year?
Tyler:
It's over 2 million that hit our career site and fill out a talent form. And beyond that it's probably double that. About 4 million that just see it.
Chad:
Again, ask yourself, did I have any fucking clue that this was going on?
Joel:
Bill, do you know how much traffic yeti.com gets?
Bill:
Generally, yes. I get data.
Joel:
Would you share that or no?
Bill:
Well, I would share it, but like I would have to look at my Tableau report from this morning.
Joel:
I can tell you there's a good chance that between 10 and 18% probably go to the job section.
Would you guys agree with that?
Allyn:
I actually think that number's a lot bigger. On our end, we find that-
Joel:
That you can buy coolers at their website.
Allyn:
You're not going to buy a chip at my website. But we find that the career page is the number one driver for the consumer site for all Intel external-
Chad:
And we've actually seen that through data and analytics from all big time brands. They look at their web traffic and the number one it used to be, now this has changed, the number one is the home site and the second was the career site. They were going to the homepage to get to the career site. But with search engine optimization and these huge footprints that companies are putting together, how many jobs do you have open now?
Tyler:
About 5,000.
Chad:
5,000?
Tyler:
Yeah.
Chad:
Holy shit.
Tyler:
Give or take.
Chad:
That is actually a footprint, right? That's a footprint that Google can see and you're using a platform. You actually use SmashFly to be able to build out that footprint. So that footprint is seen by Google. So you're having people do job searches on Google and they're going directly to the actual jobs on your webpages. Tell me about that experience itself and do you work with marketing at all four basic job descriptions?
Allyn:
No, and we should. And I think we would love to do that.
Chad:
Has marketing asked you?
Allyn:
No.
Chad:
Why the hell aren't we involved?
Allyn:
Oh no. Nobody pays attention to the job descriptions unless there's something written in it that offends somebody and then they all call me. In 99% of the time people see job descriptions and by the way, they usually are as completely transactional purchase orders.
Joel:
Cold and corporate.
Allyn:
Exactly. Cold and corporate. This is my list of skills and requirements is all very legal and there's all this compliance around it and et cetera. We really see a clear distinction between the job description and the job ad. And for us as we start thinking about our partnerships in the marketing space, we really want to figure out how to get better at translating what is essentially a purchase order into something that's a compelling job advertisement that is real and authentic and helps people really understand what it's like to work in our environment. You don't get that from a job description.
Chad:
So to clarify real quick here, job description is more of a technical document, right?
Allyn:
Exactly.
Chad:
It's a technical document. The problem is, most companies use job descriptions as their job postings. Because lazy, they're not marketing. Because you guys aren't giving them the time they deserve. Anyway, the posting itself is the job description. The job description should be the marketing angle on selling the brand. Right?
Allyn:
Right.
Chad:
So Bill, is this news to you?
Bill:
Yeah, a little bit. Because we definitely do get involved in our job descriptions. We're a much different, much smaller than you guys. You guys have a real thing going and an engine really rolling. And we hire I think it was close to 300 people last year. So we're hiring about a person a day. And for us the talent acquisition group is like, "Okay, this is the job that I know is coming." The job descriptions requirement is on our side.
Bill:
The only thing about it is, and why this isn't a surprise is as we're growing, we're starting to cut and paste a little bit with job descriptions because it's a little bit easier and quicker and we're not probably taking the time to really... And then we let talent scrub it up a little bit and then post it and away they go. But we do make sure and work with our talent group. We have a much smaller group of people we're going after than you guys.
Joel:
And I think it's an important distinction, what Chad said was something that sort of happened in our industry in the past few years where Google has gotten into our industry. There are about a 100 million to 150 million people or searches done every month, in the States for job searches. So one of the things I wanted to point out is that marketing and typically gets involved with like the careers page and life at Intel and they do all these pages.
Joel:
But what's happening is job seekers go are going directly from Google or indeed directly to the job description. They're not even going to your careers page. So marketers should pay more attention to the actual job description because that's where more and more traffic is going directly. And in light of that, I'm curious, what was the last time any of you applied to a job at your company? Just to see the process.
Tyler:
I'm not even sure I work at my company. Things happen, I don't know.
Allyn:
He's like, I just see the numbers stuff. I don't know. I usually go into, my job is focused on trying to understand the experience and that's the lens that I take. It's part of my job to go and apply and I do it regularly, at least once a month. I'll tell you this, it doesn't change. It still sucks. It sucked a month ago and it'll suck next month. It'll suck the month after that.
Joel:
So we'll get to that in a second. Bill was last time you went through the process? Open and honest that's what we like.
Bill:
When I was forced to apply for the job that I have now.
Tyler:
Forced. That's a great-
Bill:
They're like, "Hey, we really want you to come in and interview. We want you to do this job." That's four and a half years ago. I was like, "Great." "All right. Go to the website and apply." And then you apply and it's like, I don't have any idea who the six people I need to list in all these things. And I'm like, "You called me."
Chad:
Real quick, we're starting to get into the meat of this. So you're all in. Now, I want you to do your little Twitter intro. Pretty much everybody knows who you are, but real quick, who are you, what do you do? And then all the way down the line real quick.
Bill:
I'm at Yeti Coolers and I'm Vice President of Consumer Marketing.
Tyler:
I'm at Intel. I'm the head of HR Data Science.
Chad:
Holy shit. What?
Tyler:
I'm a physicist and an artist and I love telling stories. That's what it is.
Chad:
Just keep that mic close to yourself. That's all I got.
Allyn:
Could you hold it the right way?
Tyler:
Sorry, I'm totally screwing this up.
Allyn:
We give each other a hard time. We travel way too much together. Tyler is, we're like two sides of the same coin. I work in the talent acquisition space, but my focus is around experienced design and driving a larger base of our candidates to understand what it's like to work at our company, but also to build our culture through our candidate base. And so I'm Allyn and that's what I do.
Joel:
So the other takeaway for everyone in the audience is I want you to, before you leave Canada or band, is apply to a job at your company and just see how it is. See if your brand translates well into the apply process. And I'm going to take a bet that most of them don't and you'll be shocked at how cold and corporate and little that your brand comes through when you apply to a job. So I went through and applied to both of your companies before the podcast.
Chad:
It's like Jerry Springer moment.
Allyn:
I know, I'm like...
Joel:
And now, who's the father?.
Allyn:
I apologize now.
Bill:
Pop out of the cooler. Hi Dad!
Joel:
That would be good. For next time.
Bill:
Yes.
Joel:
Not turning out to be mean, but some constructive criticism because Yeti, your brand is very, it's warm, it's exciting, it's challenging the boundaries of what everything is. So I went into apply and the good news is it was a one page, pretty simple attach your resume. I liked that you had the ability to add a file, like a video file. So someone could actually, I don't know, go surfing and then go on the beach and say, "I want to work at Yeti because of whatever." So they could really build their personality in terms of their resume.
Joel:
I think where you dropped off a little bit was once you applied, the thank you message was like a lawyer wrote it. So I went through this whole process and I'm on Yeti and I love their stuff and I want to work there. And then it's like, I get the lawyers. And there wasn't anything like thank you, now follow us on whatever social media. Or we'd love to stay in touch or here's a coupon for 20% off your next Yeti purchase.
Joel:
So I think from a marketing perspective and brand, that was an opportunity to say, thanks for your time, we appreciate it. Now here's a real thank you. And then the second, probably worst part of the process was the follow-up email. So thumbs up that there was actually a follow-up email. A lot of companies don't do that and you should make sure that you do. But it was super legalese and it was like, "If you don't hear from us in six weeks, just assume that you didn't get the job."
Joel:
So you have an entire opportunity in an email to brand and build that message and keep that going and build some warm and fuzzies. And I ended the process feeling really cold and like I'm just part of the process now. So, overall you were better than Intel and I'll get to them in a sec.
Bill:
Thank you very much.
Allyn:
I'm ready. What happened.
Chad:
But still from a consumer brand standpoint, from your standpoint, you are touching customers. These individuals actually want to be a part of your cult, not just buy your shit. They want to be a part of your cult. So, how does that make you feel?
Bill:
I think it's really interesting. I hadn't applied for a job on the site. You assume that stuff is just sort of being done. I promise you it sounded like a lawyer wrote it because they did. But that's incredible feedback. We'll get upwards of 30,000 people applying for a single job. And while that's, may not be a lot for you guys, but it is a lot for us. How do you scale and then sustain as we continue to grow? But it's probably really smart of us to get in front of that now.
Bill:
Because the truth is if I was applying for a job at Yeti, I would want that there's a different emotional thing happening and not anything against Intel, but you guys are powerhouses. And so I'm not sure if I'm going there, it's because I'm probably really smart. And I don't know if I would expect the same type of butterflies in like and candy canes.
Tyler:
You said something that's actually interesting. You said we've got about 30,000 applicants. That's probably not a lot for us. That's a huge amount. And in fact-
Bill:
Because you have 5,000 jobs open right now.
Tyler: