Snark Attack w/ Matt Charney


Time to turn the snark up to eleven, people. Four years in the making, industry icon - or at least iconic in millennial terms - Matt Charney sits down with the boys for a chat about his latest role at SmartRecruiters, his take on the hottest HR tech vendors at the moment, and his distaste for most-things-SHRM. Resistance is futile. Turn it up!


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PODCAST TRANSCRIPTION sponsored by:

Disability Solutions provides training and development to help your workplace leaders and employees integrate with and value people with disabilities.


INTRO (4s):

Hide your kids! Lock the doors! You're listening to HR’s most dangerous podcast. Chad Sowash and Joel Cheeseman are here to punch the recruiting industry, right where it hurts! Complete with breaking news, brash opinion and loads of snark, buckle up boys and girls, it's time for the Chad and Cheese podcast.


Wait... who is integrated with Smart Recruiters?



Joel (23s):

Oh yeah. Matt Charney, Unchained, everybody. You listening to the Chad and Cheese podcast. I'm your cohost Joel Cheeseman joined as always by Chad Sowash. And today we are so lucky to finally have Matt Charney, industry icon as a guest on the show. He's got a new job, which we'll get to in a second, but Matt, four years in the making you're finally on the show. What are your thoughts? And for those who don't know you, what should they know about you?


Chad (56s):

Welcome to 1950s radio. Go ahead.


Matt (59s):

Thank you. Thank you. I would actually put it in the forties when they were serializing everything, cause they actually a TV now. Right? Okay. So my name is Matt Charney. The last name is Charney if you are in recruiting, you should be able to Google and find out a bunch of information about me, but I am a long time listener, first time caller is it were. But I have been working in this space for a long time. I have blogged snarkily, maybe a little bit too much for over 10 years now. And my major areas of interest are


Joel (1m 34s):

What's the cease and desist letter count up to now?


Matt (1m 36s):

Oh My goodness. Are we including LinkedIn?


Joel (1m 38s):

Sure.


Chad (1m 39s):

Of course.


Matt (1m 40s):

Hundreds and hundreds.


Chad (1m 44s):

There you go.


Matt (1m 47s):

I have, I've kept a lot of product councils, very busy in my time, which is cool because one of the things that I'm really, really like passionate about is making sure that good recruiters have good products and don't buy things like eharmony. So


Chad (2m 1s):

The eharmony for jobs or the Tinder for jobs, which we've evolved into.


Joel (2m 7s):

Soon to be Bumble for jobs. I think the, are we Bumble for jobs now?


Chad (2m 12s):

How about Grindr?


Joel (2m 13s):

Grinder for jobs


Matt (2m 16s):

Grinder for jobs is what you're no longer allowed to do in the entertainment industry.


Joel (2m 21s):

So Matt, you got a new job, man. Tell us about it.


Matt (2m 24s):

I do. So I have the very official sounding title of Director of Product and Industry Marketing for Smart Recruiters.


Joel (2m 35s):

That is sexy as hell.


Matt (2m 37s):

It is.


Chad (2m 38s):

I like that. I'll put that on a t-shirt.


Matt (2m 41s):

Make it an appearance. No, so, and if you want it on a t-shirt, I'm sure I can make that happen. So essentially, you know what I've done for, God longer than I care to admit, so let's say at least 10 years now is covering the industry from all different sides, whether that is from working with startups to help, you know, accelerate their revenue and valuation, to working with big professional services organization, to define text backs, to overseeing partnerships and also covering news and other stuff. So I really, for a really long time resisted giving up my product neutrality, which is why I joined Allegiance, right?


Matt (3m 24s):

Because they don't have necessarily a whole lot of skin or at the time, in the product game. But I realized in being vendor agnostic that certain vendors kicked a lot more ass than the others. And so one company that I've been working with largely throughout my entire career is Smart Recruiters. And I think I first tried to get a job there when I was still at Recruiting Daily. And they were like, no, no, our customers are going to leave en mass? So, you know, it's been a company evolve for a long time. I'm really, you know, from a product perspective, nothing in an HR tech is really that sexy, right? But when it comes down to it, it's about people and mentality. And I think that the combination of challenger brand status, so a willingness to shake things up, the fact that, you know, they have really been a pretty big advocate from both the grassroots and, you know, cutting checks perspective for a lot of the different events and programs.


Matt (4m 21s):

And then also the trust that they gave in me both as an, you know, as somebody who's done some project work for them. And then just, you know, on the scene, for example, while I was getting yelled at, by my old employers, for things that I tweeted, Smart Recruiters gave me their Twitter access says, come do a live tweet, our, user conference under your account, or Hey, would you like to be on a diversity panel with our new chief diversity officer and three of our biggest customers. So I think that their willingness to let me play in boundaries, the most companies would probably find to be antithetical to their go to market strategy was definitely really attractive.


Matt (5m 1s):

And I think at this point they're a big enough company where I'm not going to have to be doing everything, but at the same time, early stage enough where I can definitely make an impact on both the products and how that product is shaped by the market.


Chad (5m 19s):

Are you doing much writing these days?


Matt (5m 21s):

I am. And you're not going to see, you're not going to see a lot of it quite yet, but I am starting to build the pipeline again. So I have 102 posts that are sitting, waiting to be published. And the question is where.


Chad (5m 37s):

How do you do 102 posts and not, they don't turn stale on you?


Matt (5m 42s):

No evergreen contents the, you know, I actually think ...


Joel (5m 45s):

He wrote them 8 years ago.


Matt (5m 47s):

I did.


Joel (5m 49s):

That seems to be boring though, because it's so broad. If you can't like zone in on something that's happening right now. So you don't, you don't see that timeliness important.


Matt (5m 58s):

Like, so what's the oddest topics. Like if you're going to tell me, probably you'll add to this list. Candidate experience, the gift that keeps on giving except to candidate, right? Like nothing has changed DNI, a big imperative. Let's talk about that to the exclusivity.


Chad (6m 16s):

Now it's DEI. So now all your D and I say, you're going to have to go back and do a fucking, a word switch.


Matt (6m 23s):

It's actually DEIB plus. Now that's a good point. Y