Robot Lump Theory

Thanks to last week's "predictions show," this episode encompasses a whopping two weeks of news from the world of recruitment. On tap, let's start with some shitty optics from Indeed's newest toy, ClickIQ. Then let's move into news that Walmart is going all-in on robots and Taco Bell paying mad salaries to recruit and retain top talent. The dessert: A tasty acquisition and a fat new investment. As usual, show powered by Sovren, Canvas, and JobAdx.


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Jim Stroud: 15 minutes ago. The world changed. Companies are microchipping their workers. Robots are hiring humans and brain to brain communication is a thing. This is all happening now. If you want to know what happens next, listen to the Jim Straub podcast.

Intro: Hide your kids, lock the doors, you're listening to HR's most dangerous podcast. Chad Sowash and Joel Cheesman are here to punch the recruiting industry right where it hurts. Complete with breaking news, brash opinion and loads of snark. Buckle up boys and girls. It's time for the Chad and Cheese fun pack!

Joel: Aw Yeah. What's up boys and girls?

Chad: What up?

Joel: The predictions' episode from last week has put us behind two weeks in the new cycle. So we're all backed up and ready to spew! Welcome to the Chad and Cheese podcast. I'm your cohost Joel Cheesman.

Chad: And I'm Chad 'I love guacamole' Sowash.

Joel: On this week’s show Phenom people get a phenomenally big check. ClickIQ has an optics problem and right after this I'm applying for a job at Taco Bell and if they don't hire me, I'm eating all the chalupas!

Chad: I'm going to Chipotle.

Joel: Put on your fat boy pants. It's another episode of HR's fattest and most dangerous podcast. And what's more dangerous than an advertisement? We'll be right back after we pay a few bills.

Sovren: Sovren Parser is the most accurate resume and job order intake technology in the industry. The more accurate your data, the better decisions you can make. Find out more about our suite of products today by visiting that's S-O-V-R-E-N dot com. We provide technology that thinks, communicates and collaborates like a human. Sovren, software so human you'll want to take it to dinner.

Joel: Yes, you will. And dinner talking about taco bell. We actually just dropped the 'Chipotle Cult Guac' episode.

Chad: Got to talk to a couple of guys Joe and Mike.

Joel: Holy guacamole.

Chad: Holy guacamole. Over at Chipotle. That is a great interview.

Joel: And we were not shy about adding queso, if you know what I'm saying.

Chad: Yeah or guacamole.

Joel: Shout out to a speaking of food Zume Pizza, many of you will not know Zume, but it's sort of a sad day in the world of robotics. Zume was a, they called it co-bots, so it was people and robots working together, creating pizzas. And these trucks would go around town making the pizza while it was coming to you. And then the person would come out and bring you the pizza. Well, they're in the Deadpool for the most part. This thing didn't work out. They're making pizza boxes now as a pivot which is interesting. But the dream of like the streets being filled with food making trucks that deliver hot, delicious food to your door is at least on hold for now.

Chad: It's not going away. Okay, let's just make this, make this short and sweet. Joel I will predict by definitely in the next five years, you'll definitely have trucks with pizzas that are actually being baked on the way there.

Joel: Look at us with more predictions. We just can't get away from this stuff. But yeah, I mean we already have the dominoes, you know, little R2D2 things delivering pizzas on college campuses. So yes, it's going to happen. Zume just didn't quite have the right recipe, if you know what I'm saying.

Chad: Yes.

Joel: Whomp, whomp.

Chad: Well, I'm going to go into a long string of a bunch of overseas shout outs. First and foremost, maybe not overseas, just not in the U.S. Julie Ho over at JobAdX finally received her Chad And Cheese T-shirt, dude, she's in Canada. What the fuck is up with the Canada mail? I mean it just, does it take that long? Do you have to put it on a moose?

Joel: So I do have some experience with this because I'm married to a Canadian who has Canadian relatives. It does take that fucking long to get shit to Canada.

Chad: Good God.

Joel: However, I will say it to props to the postal service when we send out our Christmas cards this year, all the international cards, which I was sure would get there maybe right before next Christmas.

Chad: Yeah.

Joel: Actually got there in a pretty timely manner. So I don't know if they just juiced everything up for Christmas and the holidays, but yeah, for the most part the items delivered on moose back or beaver tail or something. I don't know what the fuck was going on.

Chad: A shout out to Cindy diesel listening from Johannesburg South Africa. She's with the PeopleSoft.

Joel: Is that it? She's a fan. okay.

Chad: She's a fan, she's listening.

Joel: Shout out to South Africa, South Africa, South Africa.

Chad: Big shout out to Pat Healey who is actually a staff writer and public publications officer and data scientists, believe that shit over at ESSA which is the Economics Students Society of Australia. He's a listener and he's just given a shout out for connecting on LinkedIn. The big thing for me is we have friends and listeners over in Australia, you know?

Joel: Sure.

Chad: Right now I can't but feel totally powerless with all of the fires that are happening over there. I can't imagine how they feel.

Joel: Yeah, you can go, you can donate money. That's not powerless. But I feel like the news doesn't even talk about it anymore or the fires out? I don't, I

don't even know. Did they get a good rain in?

Chad: They did get some rain. I don't think it's over in that smokes also a problem and inhalation and those types of things, so everybody over there in Australia who are listening. Yeah, man, dude, we're as much behind you as we possibly can, but again, other than feeling powerless from being a world away, it's hard watching the news about it.

Joel: A billion animals. How is that even possible?

Chad: Oh man, it's fucking crazy. It's like one out of three koalas are like dead now because of this shit.

Joel: Yeah.

Chad: Anyway, on an upward note, we're going to come back to the U.S. Tom Nolan in Jacksonville, Florida over at TextUs big shout out to him for listening.

Chad: Summer Crenshaw over in Cincinnati, pretty close to us [crosstalk 00:06:33] COO and CMO over at Tilr. And Nico's over at Next. Big shout out.

Chad: Again, thanks for listening everybody out there. Again, feel free to connect with us on LinkedIn, get a ton of those things. I will mention a few every now and again, but feel free to connect with us on LinkedIn. Go to Go to wherever you listen to podcast and subscribe.

Joel: I love it. You know Tilr's been saying they've been, they're going to come to Andy to visit us for about two years and they haven't made it up from Cincinnati. We may just have to go to The Natti, get in a reds game cause there are seats available.

Chad: Yes, Of course.

Joel: And maybe go see the kids at Tilr at some point.

Chad: Yeah and see Matt Adam cause you know he's napping right now.

Joel: I won't tell him you said that cause he's the hardest working man in that company because I think he's the only employee left in that company.

Chad: He literally did a disrupt HR presentation on naps.

Joel: That's true. That's true. But I don't know if he himself naps fairly regularly.

Chad: Oh, he does.

Joel: And as someone who does nap regularly, I don't see the telltale signs of napping in him. I'm gonna do my bunch of shout outs, I guess if you're done?

Chad: Yep.

Joel: Get Optimal is our latest Death match entry signed up this week.

Chad: Woo! Death match!

Joel: We're going to see them in London. They're headed up by a former Indeed guy. So, uh.

Chad: Good that's awesome. Yeah.

Joel: Could be an interesting addition to death match. You've you failed to mention our new voices series that's coming down the pike. Maybe that was on purpose, but Robert Ruff, CEO of Sovren founder as our first voices participant.

Chad: El Presidente.

Joel: We have a sexy new celebrity intro for voices that maybe I'll, I'll go search the voice, the MP3 files and see if I can maybe play that at the end of the show. Mark Jones from our friends in Cleveland at Alexander Mann solutions. His podcast interview went out this week, so if you haven't checked that out, we talk all things our PO candidate marketing, yada yada.

Chad: Technology. So before we jump into topics, I have a quick rant that really for the whole HR and talent acquisition community.

Joel: We haven't had a chad rant in a while. I'm excited. Let me give the boxer sound on this.

Chad: On Twitter Wendy Berry seems like a very nice person. She had a great tweet, which was pretty much the epitome of what we've seen over the years and here's what it is. Quote, "just got a rejection email this morning for a job I applied for nine months ago and here I thought I had it in the bag. Smiley face. Try harder talent acquisition and recruitment folks." So I said, "Wendy, who the fuck are you talking about? What company is this? Let's let's name some names" and Wendy said, "everybody does it." Come on Wendy. Every other talent acquisition, HR and human out there. Everybody listen, unless we start naming names, what the fuck do we expect to change here? Unless we start pointing people out and holding them accountable and driving transparency, we will not see progress. So if you don't name names, you're bitching for nothing. So stop your bitching.

Joel: Shame away people. Shame away.

Chad: Stop it. Be accountable if they fucked up some kind of process or in this case, getting back with you nine months later, name the names and quit being wusses is out there HR talent acquisition.

Joel: Would it be too bold of a prediction to guess that Wendy is a millennial?

Chad: It would not.

Joel: I'm just going to put that out there, that they're a little bit less likely to offend people than other generations.

Chad: Yes, sensitive.

Joel: Yes, yes. All right, Chad rant people, get excited.

Chad: All right, let's get to the show shall we?

Chad: Let's do this - TOPICS!

Joel: So we did, we did predictions with Tim Sackett, which was an awesome show. It was fun to do and we invited listeners to submit their own predictions and I don't know any of these, so I'm going to be surprised by these and I'm going to let you just sort of read them off and maybe I'll comment.

Chad: Okay. You're going in blind. Well first and foremost, Jason Roberts, he actually quoted and said, we actually got one of those predictions right, that we thought we got wrong. Google is almost always the number one referral source of candidate traffic over Indeed. It actually was before they released Google for jobs as well. We, and in this case it was RSR, we saw a 30% increase in traffic after Google for jobs launched while indeed was flat to 10% down depending on the client. So Indeed stayed flat or they actually dropped 10%. Now again, this is coming from Jason's experience when he was at Randstad. Sure. There we go. We thought we went O for last year, we actually got one and that was like a second half to one of your predictions this year. So we can go ahead and wipe that off cause we already got it.

Joel: Well I'm still holding to the monetization thing. They're going to start pay per click. But yeah, it does matter depending on the organization, like some will not see Google number one, many will.

Chad: And a company like Randstad or Randstad SourceRight represents hundreds of companies. So what they can do is, what we've talked about over the years is that staffing and RPO does recruitment better because it's their business. They have to be more efficient, they have to attract with less amount of money. So I think if you are in talent acquisition and you're not seeing Google as your number one, that's because you haven't optimized enough. That's because you haven't focused on efficiencies. You haven't done things that the staffing professionals do because it is their business and that's how they make money.

Joel: Yep. So Indeed if you're listening,

SFX: That's it man. Game over, man. Game Over.

Chad: The second one comes from a good friend of ours and friend of the show, Michael O'Dell at or as we know Neuvoo, he predicts with all of the acquisitions that happened in 2019 there will be more programmatic entrants into the market because these new entrants can provide independent options that today are starting to dwindle because those programmatic companies are going under brands like indeed.

Joel: Hmm. Interesting. I agree. There's a need for more, although I also think it's not easy to just set up shop with a programmatic solution that's worth a shit. So yeah, we'll see. And maybe, maybe that's a little glimpse into what the folks at Neuvoo we were working on as well.

Chad: He didn't say they have to be worth a shit. He just said that there are new entrants. Oh, next prediction from Quincy Valencia, the queen of chat bots and stuff over at the Alexander Mann solution.

Joel: The chat bot queen.

Chad: She predicts robots will continue to encroach on recruiter and coordinated spaces, forcing companies to start to radically redesign how their talent acquisition teams are structured and how they operate.

Chad: I think she's early on this, I think personally, RPO. Yes. I think RPO, you're going to see this and I think companies who start to look at RPO are going to believe that this is kind of like table stakes, but for companies to do this themselves, I think we're still a couple of years early because hell we're already five years back as it is.

Joel: Yeah, and a very cerebral prediction from Quincy. I'm not even sure what I just heard, but I'm sure it was really smart.

Chad: So next coming from our millennial, Kyle Hager.

Joel: Yes!

Chad: He is predicting that a ton of small ATS's will consolidate due to Indeed starting to cut off. There are organic traffic. One of the biggest advantages for having an ATS for small or medium sized businesses today was candidate attraction. Currently is candidate attraction through organic. I'm not that, not the paid stuff. Apparently indeed is shutting the spigot off for small applicant tracking system companies and those ATS is are feeling it and obviously so are their clients.

Joel: So did I hear that right? They're going to join forces?

Chad: They're going to consolidate some form or fashion. Consolidate or die is pretty much what it comes down to.

Joel: Okay. This sounds very millennial from our buddy Kevin. They're going to, they're going to all get together, create one big death star and compete with the big boys. Yeah, we'll see how that works.

Chad: I think it's more if they don't consolidate, through mergers and acquisitions, they're going to die.

Joel: Well, it's usually a big fish that swallows the little fish. He's saying like all these little fish somehow evolve into one big fish. I'm just really confused at how this is going to work.

Chad: Next prediction coming from Mark Feffer over at

Joel: The Feff.

Chad: Yeah. Much like I think a Quincy, very cerebral.

Joel: Oh my God.

Chad: He is predicting that automation becomes table stakes. Last year and into this year's vendors talk more and more about tools that somehow streamlined the talent acquisition process. Usually by automating chores like interview scheduling, so on, so forth. By the end of this year, those features won't be differentiators anymore. They will be expected.Joel: I'll agree with that. I think that's a pretty good prediction. I think if you're a vendor and don't have that stuff like you're not even going to get a second glance. I don't think.

Chad: And you shouldn't.

Joel: I think it's going to be expected. Yeah. Like it's like mobile, Oh your shit looks like shit on mobile. Like fuck you. I'm not even going to play ball. Like it's just something you have to do.

Chad: Yep. Exactly.

Joel: So.

Chad: And last but not least, we have Josh Zywien a.k.a Jay Z is over at paradox. He predicts the growth of voice in video as dominant channels for transactions, automation and direct audience engagement. User generator videos and video telling the real authentic stories will grow exponentially, particularly as the cost to create and distribute it goes way down and people become more disenchanted with the traditional channels.

Joel: Yeah. I think a JZ might have 99 predictions, but that was not a good one in my opinion.

Chad: Dude.

Joel: Yeah. Videos just it's too, I don't know it's too far. We've had video for how long and it hasn't taken off. Right. We had this with higher view selling, it shit off and it's investors getting out. I don't know. I don't know dude. Like I'm just the jury, so out on video, I just, I don't pay attention unless it's really something significant.

Chad: Again, back to audio. I think that's where we're going to see some really cool shit, whether it's Alexa, Google, assistant w whatever it is. But also being able to do those things and podcast form. Something that's more portable. So yeah, I agree with partially with that. The video part's really hard to get on board with.

Joel: Well, either way. To all of our, I don't know, second rate predictors, thanks for chiming in. We love you.

Chad: Yeah, we love it. Love it.

Joel: By the way, is Kyle employed yet?

Chad: I don't know.

Joel: What's his deal?

Chad: I don't know. I think he's, he's like sucking off a trust fund or something. I don't know.

Joel: Somebody, somebody hired this kid. He's got game.

Chad: He's got more than game man. He's pretty legit.