Best of 2021 - Chad's Picks

The Chad and Cheese have been podcasting since March of 2017 and have published nearly 800 episodes! During that time they have never pulled together a "Best of The Chad and Cheese" compilation, which highlights conversations, topics, and their deeply sarcastic opinions.

That's just absurd,

... an oversight,

... and something which needed to be rectified.

(Drumroll please)

Welcome to the very first "Best of The Chad and Cheese". In this episode, Chad picks his top 5 excerpts from interviews in 2021. These conversational segments are merely a sampling of the syrupy sweet podcasting snarky goodness which embodies the 120+ episodes The Chad and Cheese has published in 2021 alone.

Kick back, relax and stay tuned for Joel's picks!


Disability Solutions helps companies strengthen their workforce and broaden their market reach by hiring talent in the disability community.

INTRO (1s):

Hide your kids! Lock the doors! You're listening to HR’s most dangerous podcast. Chad Sowash and Joel Cheeseman are here to punch the recruiting industry, right where it hurts! Complete with breaking news, brash opinion and loads of snark, buckle up boys and girls, it's time for the Chad and Cheese podcast.

Chad (31s):

Hey, this is Chad. Welcome to my top five picks of 2021. This is actually the very first best of Chad and Cheese podcast we have ever pulled together. So with this podcast episode, I wanted to curate and stitch together moments in time. That would be incredibly valuable to talent, acquisition leaders and vendors alike. We're starting off the top five of 2021 with an excerpt from a podcast entitled Burn, Build, Rinse and Repeat with JCK that dropped just in August. This excerpt highlights something that I cannot beat my drum loud enough about, and that is the symbiotic relationship TA should have with marketing.

Chad (1m 15s):

It's not just about ownership of an employment brand, rather it's about holistic impact on revenues through getting the best candidates. But in this case, we're just going to nail down the basics as Jenny Cotie Kangas, AKA JCK director, digital experience and talent acquisition at Regis Corp talks about some of the foundational advantages about building such a partnership with marketing, and she kindly shares a fail/slash learning moment as well. Enjoy.

Joel (1m 49s):

Do you work internally with marketing or your agency, is that something you're doing now or thinking about?

Jenny (1m 55s):

Oh, a hundred percent. So if you don't, if anybody listening to this doesn't work closely with your marketing internally, y'all go start right now, because they should be your best friend and figure out a way to work with them.

Chad (2m 9s):

Amen sister.

Joel (2m 9s):

That's awesome.

Jenny (2m 9s):

Yeah. I just, you know, when we're looking at what converts and multi-source attribution and telling stories with numbers, our marketing counterparts have done that for a lot longer than we have. And we can learn a lot from them. I mean, one of my really good friends, Mike Lewis, he owns a company that essentially it's customer journey optimization and tells you what's converting and what's what touches are going to convert versus others. And it's like you guys, and he's taught me pretty much all that I know, a lot about this space and it's allowed me to, to play a lot faster and kind of the recruiting world. But like at the end of the day, you need those collaborations because you know, you guys play for the same team.

Jenny (2m 55s):

It's the name of the front, not the team in the back. And so I work very closely with our internal marketing teams. We've gone through a lot of changes. We had a pretty significant restructuring kind of here recently and now marketing sits very differently, but I'm very, very, very thankful to our internal marketing, marketing, friends.

Joel (3m 37s):

Any success stories you can share?

Jenny (3m 38s):

One of our first initial conversations was really just about like, okay, well, we're planning on putting additional content in one of these channels. And I looked at the channel mix and they said, yeah, LinkedIn's not on there and that's a problem. And they had said, like, well, what do you mean stylists aren't on LinkedIn? I said, yep, check your design bias there because stylists are on LinkedIn. And also like, it's free to storytell on there. I'm talking about like traditional, just storytelling. And that's the first place that we should be leveraging before, like the last. And so just that conversation, I think really, really helped too. So they went back and re-strategized and we're working with some outside agencies to help us build out what that storytelling piece looks like. But, that was a really, really good start. I learned my lesson to check with marketing versus, here's a fun story working with one of our vendors who is putting together a video at the technology about we've built. So I brought franchisees to the table last. I was originally brought in to solve a tech problem. And when I came in and started to look into like, what's the problem? I first asked, like, what's going on here? Instead of just like hitting the gates running and came to find the technology, we have this broken, but there was underlying issues if we weren't handling recruiting right. And if we didn't get that right on the front end of our experience, or at least calibrate the problem that like, Hey, y'all recruiting is important if you want to have like somebody to serve your customers.

Jenny (4m 26s):

When in search while I was fixing the technology, went in search of technology to start to build, to meet our needs. And so brought our franchisees to the table to build that because ultimately I can guess, but I probably will get it wrong.

Jenny (5m 10s):

And so over the last nine months, we've essentially sharpened the critical tech. And we went to make a video for that technology because it's essentially like Alexa for recruiting and conceptually people just can't understand it or wrap their head around it. And so we had to make a video. I got the franchisee that was local to the table. I got the franchise consultant in the mix like here, I thought I was stepping and checking all the boxes. I did not connect with marketing first, which was a terrible, terrible choice because on the flip side I sent the video which was done and it was amazing to my marketing leader. And she said, I'm going to send you an email. I've got a couple pieces of feedback. And I'm like, oh crap, I get the email.

Jenny (5m 50s):

And it's like a page long of like this piece of collateral is three years old. This pieces of collateral is five years old. Don't show that because we don't, we don't offer that product line anymore. Like all of this stuff. And I was like, I turned to my CPO and I said, lesson learned when we film anything, we are checking with marketing first and then second and then third, and then we're going to film something.

Chad (6m 21s):


Joel (6m 21s):

It's commercial time.

Chad (6m 22s):

It's show time. Okay. So after this next podcast aired, we experienced a ton of engagement from listeners who personally reached out to us and said, these are our people. The podcast is entitled Move Fast. Break Shit. Burn Out and dropped in March. Tracey Lovejoy and Shannon Lucas joined us to talk about their crazy awesome book, Move Fast. Break Shit. Burn Out. And this segment hones in on how we, as leaders identify and empower those diamond in the rough employees, AKA catalysts, instead of thrusting them into frustration and burnout.

Chad (7m 4s):

Enjoy. So in most cases, when you feel like you are moving at light speed, you see a lot of shit that's happening around you, you see the dots and you're connecting the dots. But most of the people that you're actually talking with and dealing with on a daily basis, they can't even see the dots, let alone connect them. Right? So what we're saying is those individuals and I've had that feeling my entire life. Those individuals really can burn out fast, but they also have issues because it's hard to work within a team when they can't even understand what you're talking about a lot of times.

Chad (7m 46s):

Cause it's hard to articulate what's going on in your brain. How, as a leader, how do you identify that? And how do you help that individual? Because the last thing you want to lose is an individual like that. Even though they're not fitting in, what do you do? How does that work?

Shannon (8m 1s):

I mean, the identification, as I mentioned earlier, when people are reading the book, as people start to understand, you know, the highlight of what it means to be a catalyst, their brain sort of naturally goes to those people in their life because they do stand up, they show up differently. We often get called, you know, get named monikers like troublemaker or disruptor and not always in a positive sense, especially if we're not self-aware to Tracey's point. You know, part of the point of the book is to give the catalyst themselves the skills to be less disruptive, which doesn't mean stopping change. It just means doing it in a way that brings other people along more effectively.

Shannon (8m 41s):

So it's not hard to identify them. We work with organizations like we can have surveys and self-identification tools, et cetera. One thing that Tracey and I talked a lot about early on when we started this work is, do we want to be the labelers of catalysts or do we let catalyst sort of lean in and name themselves? And we came pretty heavily down on that second one. Like if the word cat, even if you all the attributes fit you, if being a catalyst doesn't resonate with you, then that's fine. And then I think there's a great question there about, you know, as a leader, how do we support them? Obviously myself as a leader, I was a catalyst and so I had to surround myself with people who could translate, you know, that had catalytic capabilities, but could also help me bring the rest of the organization along.

Shannon (9m 22s):

And so intentionality is a word that we use a lot in all of this work is like, how can the catalyst be more intentional about the work that they're doing, but also how can the leaders intentionally support them, making sure that they're not spread thin chasing all of the new shiny projects or opportunities, but helping them to prioritize, giving them the surroundings and removing some of the barriers that might, you know, get in their way. And I think one of the key things from that perspective is psychological safety. You know, once organizations recognize that they have these VUCA ready people, they will send them on these heroes missions, okay, go out into the world and figure out what we need to do next.

Shannon (10m 3s):

And by definition, that's usually some kind of divergent thinking from the way the organization currently operates. So they go out, they do their vision quest and they come back, hopefully they can now clearly articulate their vision, but it could cause such cognitive dissonance for how the organization operates that either the idea gets attacked or the catalyst themselves gets attacked. So it's really then incumbent on the leader to help create a space of psychological safety, to have healthy conversations about whi