Zip-a-de Recruiter


Zip a-de-do-da, zip-a-de ZipRecruiter!


Since going public in May, the No. 2 job site in the US has been on a tear, and the boys outline everything, including a Facebook partnership and an assault on Glassdoor.


We play Remote Rapid Fire and break down reopening headlines from Google, LinkedIn, Amazon and much more.

Don’t call it a comeback! ,Job boards are back in fashion, kinda like Cheesman’s fanny pack.


It's another blockbuster sponsored by Sovren, JobAdx, and Jobvite.


PODCAST TRANSCRIPTION sponsored by:

Disability Solutions helps businesses find qualified candidates with disabilities for their job postings.


INTRO (1s):

Hide your kids! Lock the doors! You're listening to HR’s most dangerous podcast. Chad Sowash and Joel Cheeseman are here to punch the recruiting industry, right where it hurts! Complete with breaking news, brash opinion and loads of snark, buckle up boys and girls, it's time for the Chad and Cheese podcast.


Joel (20s):

Oh yeah. Excessive heat warnings, raging brush priors, tropical storm, Fred and out of control inflation in my pants. What up boys and girls your at your favorite guilty pleasure. The Chad and Cheese podcast. This is your co-host Joel "not the new Jeopardy host" Cheeseman. And


Chad (38s):

This is Jason Voorhees


Joel (40s):

And on this week show Zip gets a little pep in it step, Google's pay calculator and job boards strike back minus the ewoks of course. Wait a minute. That was Return of the Jedi.


Chad (52s):

Fuck.


Joel (54s):

It's the Friday the 13th edition. Chad, are you scared?


Chad (1m 0s):

No, not at all. I, if it was Michael Myers, and it was Halloween that'd be one thing, Jason Voorhees not scary. Yeah, no.


Joel (1m 8s):

The sixties hockey mask just isn't as scary as it used to be. Fortunately, it's not like a present day hockey mask. That would not be very scary at all.


Chad (1m 16s):

No, what they need to do is they need to do a Jason Vorhees, Jimmy John's commercial with Brad Garrett.


Joel (1m 24s):

Frickin Jimmy's John's.


Chad (1m 27s):

Jason Voorhees like shows up with one of their Jimmy John's wraps.


Joel (1m 30s):

The new wrap, it's got croutons, boss.


Chad (1m 33s):

Frickin' Jimmy's John's.


Joel (1m 35s):

Well speaking of Friday the 13th my first shout out, goes to Rudy Giuliani.


Chad (1m 39s):

Oh God.


Joel (1m 40s):

Everyone's favorite vampire. He is now on cameo. You can have Rudy on your phone for only $325. What better way to wish someone a happy birthday or scare the shit out of them than sending Rudy America's mayor to their mobile phone to say hi there.


Chad (1m 57s):

It says a little something. How do you think he's going to be paying his attorney fees via cameo?


Joel (2m 3s):

Yes. By the way, he's now more expensive than a Ivan Drago. Would you rather have a say happy birthday to you to Dolf Lungren or Rudy?


Chad (2m 12s):

Anybody, anybody, but Giuliani. Big shout out to Liz Scully. I got to say, Liz is one of the best commenters on my social posts. Thanks so much for engaging Liz. She has colorful commentary and snark that pretty much matches ours. I love that. Okay.


Joel (2m 30s):

Idk if you heard this, Chad, but football is almost here, baby. So I got a, I got a couple of shout outs. These are cult Indianapolis cults-related oh, sorry, sorry, Adam Gordon. We're gonna go American football here for a second. So if you missed Edgar and James, his hall of fame speech, it's fantastic. It was, it was great to me. It was inspirational. It was funny. So if you haven't seen that, I encourage you to do it.


Chad (2m 54s):

I'm going to stick with football, but I'm gonna go with my favorite NCAA, but not my favorite team, but, but they're, they're now getting closer to my heart Lane Kiffin and the Ole Miss Rebels and NCAA football, a big shout out for being 100% vaccinated, the entire team being a great example of team over individualism. Currently the state of Mississippi is vaccinated at 42% and is tied with Idaho as the lowest vaccinated state. You've got to love the leadership here. They didn't mandate it, although they did a shit ton of education and they talked about team.


Chad (3m 37s):

And that's one of the things that I think we're missing in the discussion right now is that everybody who's talking about, no masks, no vaccination. It's all about themselves. It's not about how you spread and how, how do you, how do you safeguard your community, your neighborhood, your family, right? So I think this is a great leadership by Ole Miss Rebels


Joel (3m 58s):

God, he had to bring this shit up. So I'm going to, I'm going to do a quick, a soap box. So I've been thinking about this a lot lately and it made me angry and it still does, but it started it starting to make me sort of sad because you and I are old enough to remember grandparents stories about the depression, about sacrificing during World War II, whether it be rationing food, or, you know, turning the lights out at a certain, whatever it was, right. There was a, there was a community, a sense of community that just isn't there today. And I just think it's really sad that we're a generation removed from people that really sacrificed for the community and the country.


Joel (4m 41s):

And that you're right now, it's all about the individual.


Chad (4m 44s):

People suck.


Joel (4m 46s):

People really suck.


Chad (4m 47s):

Who doesn't suck. Bas van DeHatred. He thank you for sharing a business insider story, entitled 3 explanations for the later labor shortage according to Morgan Stanley, you probably know that guy. Number one, school closures, but we're opening back up, right? So hopefully that's not going to be a problem here in the near future. There are many, many school board meetings where they're talking about mandating masks, right? There's there's a lot, that's going on today.


Joel (5m 16s):

One famous one here in Indianapolis, in my neck of the woods, McCourtsville.


Chad (5m 21s):

To a mismatch between the industry's hiring and the people who are actually looking for jobs. So there's this huge mismatch which we've had before. The problem is corporate America, you guys need to fix that. You've got the money. You need to fix that. And number three, people moved during the pandemic, but the jobs didn't. Right? So, and we're going to be talking about remote work. Some of these jobs can not be done remote. And some people moved during the pandemic and they're not remote workers. So there are some very compelling reasons here and no question and are ones that employers are going to have to fucking figure it out.


Joel (6m 2s):

Yeah. There was an interesting perspective in Business Insider today about, I guess the catch 22, if you will, of employers want to mandate it, but they're also in a talent crunch so they don't want to piss off employees and make them quit. So it's sort of this roundabout, like, we don't want to risk losing people because it's so hard to hire people and around we go. So I guess I sort of sympathize with some of the companies who feel like they're in that position.


Chad (6m 29s):

Yeah. You got to ask what's the bigger risk? Somebody who's not vaccinated who's working with you who comes in catches it, dies.


Joel (6m 36s):

Sure. Infects customers, infects other employees.


Chad (6m 40s):

Death is the biggest risk. So when you're like saying I sympathize, no fuck that. You take a look at the, take a look at the balance sheet, right? The balance sheet is death versus somebody leaving your company. No, fuck that.


Joel (6m 55s):

All right. Little lighter, lighter, lighter shout out here. TikTok. We got to have a show with TikTok. TikTok surpassed Facebook become the world's most downloaded social media app in 2020. Holy shit.


Chad (7m 9s):

I love TikTok. Also love Jenny Volak who loves the podcast. She said the podcast has creativity, plain speak. Which means that we say, fuck a lot. And last but not least honesty. That's right, Jenny. Thanks so much. And we don't always hit the nail on the head, but we do our best. And that being said, Jenny and everybody, who's listening. Feel free to go out to Apple or wherever you listen to your podcast and review the podcast. Give us one star, give us five stars. Doesn't matter. We definitely love to hear the feedback. Good, bad or indifferent. Doesn't matter.


Joel (7m 45s):

Feedback is our oxygen. Did she say creative?


Chad (7m 48s):

She said creative.


Joel (7m 49s):

That's nice.


Chad (7m 50s):

I'm tearing up.


Joel (7m 51s):

That's nice. That's nice. So I got to mention free shit if you haven't signed up yet. And what the fuck is wrong with you if you haven't?


Chad (7m 58s):

Free shit!


Joel (7m 58s):

We're giving away shirts by Emissary. We're giving away beer from AdZuna. We're giving away whiskey powered by Sovren. Head out to the Chadcheese.com/free and sign up for a chance to win guys. Why not?


Chad (8m 13s):

That's right, baby.


Joel (8m 14s):

And lastly, we got, we got, gotta talk about this. Suicide Squad, the movie.


Chad (8m 19s):

Okay.


Joel (8m 20s):

You and I differ on this. I don't want to spend a lot of time on it, but you hate it. And I loved it. Why did you hate it?


Chad (8m 26s):

Well, I hated it because I love movies that I want to go back and watch again. And like, I've watched Zack Snyder's Justice League four times and it's a four hour fucking movie. Right. So that's 16 hours of my life. No shit. But this one, after I was done with it, it was like, yeah, I don't need to see it again. And I really wouldn't want to watch it again. It just seemed very bubblegum and glossy. So I think it was good for like a teenager, but for like an adult you really want more. You were more kind of like the Easter egg inside kind of thing.


Joel (8m 58s):

I watched it with my 14 year old. So maybe I did transport back to being a 14 year old when I watched it. But I wasn't, I was not expecting much. He wanted to watch it. I've seen the first one and I was meh about it, but I said, that'll be a fun ride. And I was, I was impressed. I had a fun time. It was so over the top it was like humor. Like the humor was sort of subtle. Like when John Siena hatchets up, some dude who's sleeping and it's like, so nonchalant, just ch ch ch ch. I mean, I laughed. I thought the special effects were great. I thought it was just over the top. The acting was great. I like, I like everyone that was in it.


Joel (9m 40s):

So that was great. Like when, when Harley Quinn's going in her big scene and flowers, like start floating in the background, like I just like that kind of visual shit. So I highly recommend it.


Chad (9m 50s):

Anything with her, I would watch over again.


Joel (9m 52s):

Everything with her is always good. And fortunately for me, the critics love this movie so they're with me on this one. I need to watch this 4 hour Justice League that you keep talking about to see what all the fuss is about.


Chad (10m 4s):

I'm kind of perplexed, because I would've thought that your favorite John Sina moment, when he said he would eat a bag of dicks for freedom.


Joel (10m 12s):

Yeah. Or when he's in his underwear, I just like, why the fuck are you in your underwear? Anyway so I have, so I have another recommendation for you. If you haven't watched the Woodstock '99 documentary that's on HBO.


Chad (10m 25s):

Yeah.


Joel (10m 26s):

It's fantastic. I mean, it was sort of, it was, we sorta missed that period a little bit. We were kind of working at the time or whatever. So this kind of like Lord of the flies group mentality. It's very interesting. If you haven't watched it, I encourage you to check that out. Woodstock '99


Chad (10m 42s):

Last but not least lists, baby. We love lists. So Charlotte Hall over at zinc.work. Yeah. That's actually a website, zinc.Work, put out their top 10 podcasts for recruiters and HR professionals, and guess who was listed? That's right, baby, top 10. They gave us a little review in there as well. Check it out. And you definitely going to love that. And also major props to other Evergreen podcasts, listed Recruiting Future and Crazy and the King. Good job guys.


Joel (11m 12s):

And better than us being on it was Tim Sackett, not being on the list. I have to say that that was almost as good as us being on it. A couple of birthdays to announce before we get to news. Your favorite Cheeseman, Abby Cheeseman celebrates a birthday, this coming week and Carmen Hudson, who we love, out there in Seattle. So Carmen and Abby happy birthday. And with that.


Chad (11m 40s):

Topics!


Joel (11m 43s):

Holy shit. ZipRecruiter is on a roll baby. Let's talk about it's stock first. Okay. So up over 30% since it's IPO in May, on Monday, the recruiting firms stock relative strength rating at investors.com jumped to 83 up from 79 earlier the 83 RS rating means that ZipRecruiter stock is performing in the top 17% of all stocks. Quote, "the number of jobs available is rising along with the numbers returning to work as the pandemic eases as a result, hiring has become top priority at many companies opening the door for companies like ZipRecruiter." It has an excellent 94 at IBD composite rating.


Joel (12m 23s):

The best growth stocks have a composite rating of 90 or better. Additionally, ZipRecruiter stock holds a superb, a plus grade at accumulation distribution rating. An A-plus two east scale with a plus of course, tops. The A-plus rating means that institutional investors such as mutual funds and insurance firms are hotly buying its shares, Insider Monkey named Zip to its 15 best new tech stocks to buy now. It's earnings are today at 5:00 PM, which will be after this podcast airs. That will be very telling, but Chad, are you buying this stock with all the hoopla?


Chad (13m 2s):

Yeah. Look at the market. I keep saying this over and over and over everybody in this space, especially like a name like ZipRecruiter is going to be blowing up because employers are looking for people to hire. It's very fucking simple when they came out IPO, my opinion not don't go by this because I said it, but my opinion was buy it now and wait about a year to 18 months and then dump it. Right. I mean, take a look at the actual cycle, right. It might actually be a longer cycle than I originally thought, but right now this is the time to buy in this space period. So yeah, this doesn't surprise me at all.


Joel (13m 40s):

Yeah. And I think what the inevitable reaction to all of this is going to be a parade of IPOs in our space and all the ATSs that have gotten hundreds of millions of dollars and all the technologies that are getting a ton of money, they're all going to roll the dice in the public markets. And all this is doing is fueling the fire, those companies...


Chad (14m 1s):

Did I hear iCIMS?


Joel (14m 3s):

iCIMS, Jobvite, Smart Recruiters, maybe. Yeah. I mean, it's going to be a really fun 12 to 24 months. It's going to be a great time to have a podcast. So watch that ZipRecruiter stock and the I'm really anxious to see what the earnings report tells about the company.


Chad (14m 18s):

That being said, I gotta put a plug in for our European show that was earlier this week, it was European business brings it. Actually Cornerstone went from public to private, right? So we talk about Cornerstone. They were acquired, went public to private. Why they do that? We talk about that, but we also talk about a huge fucking acquisition between Adecco who acquired AKKA. So check that out. It's called a European Business Brings It.


Joel (14m 44s):

Yeah. Great show. Great show. So more from ZipRecruiter family, Facebook. So job seekers who receive credentials through Facebook Blueprint, which I've never heard of, but it's Facebook's platform offering online learning courses, training programs, and certifications related to digital marketing can take advantage of a new ZipRecruiter powered website to find their next great opportunity. Once an individual completes a course and receives a credential, the job seeker can import their credentials to their ZipRecruiter profile and get access to millions of additional opportunities available through ZipRecruiter's marketplace. So take that traditional college, just more certifications to get people jobs without the four-year degree.


Joel (15m 27s):

I assume you're pretty excited about this Chad.


Chad (15m 30s):

Yeah, I think it's pretty awesome. Although, again, we've never heard of Facebook blueprint. I wonder why?


Joel (15m 36s):

They don't have any money to promote it, Chad.


Chad (15m 40s):

And then you think about, okay, so why haven't they coupled this with like their jobs product? You know, I, again, I think you see these large organizations like Facebook, and we've seen it with Google before, because Google has tried jobs before and they failed miserably, or they try so much shit. And then so many things fall by the wayside. You almost have to ask yourself, you know, do you look for like a better ZipRecruiter integration into jobs, into the Facebook jobs area and then expose more of this blueprint? Right? You know, how do you actually make this work for the ecosystem? I don't know that Facebook is going to be able to pull it off, but with ZipRecruiter, I think they would have a better chance.


Joel (16m 25s):

Yeah and I think that, you know, these big brands, it's very interesting to me, you know, Google and Facebook getting into this, obviously LinkedIn learning has been around for a while. Like at some point too, people like, instead of going to college, they go, you know what, I'm going to go get a Facebook blueprint certification in digital marketing?


Chad (16m 43s):

Google cert.


Joel (16m 44s):

Or, yeah. And, and you know what, that's going to be good enough for me to get a digital marketing job somewhere. And you know what I paid for that little to nothing, right. Versus a four-year college? More and more people are going to have that inner monologue with themselves. And I think a lot of them are going to choose like, yeah, I want to get certification from Facebook or Google or LinkedIn or Microsoft or whatever. And I can go get a job in six months versus four years of, you know, killing my liver and getting the VONQ.


Chad (17m 10s):

Facebook Blueprint. I don't know how many companies are actually accepting those certifications or if they're actually external certifications. But I do know that Google is pushing their search very hard. And they have like, well, over a hundred companies that are saying, Hey, yes, we will accept these. So, I mean, it is, I agree there is a rise in certifications versus going into, you know, six figure debt.


Joel (17m 37s):

Yeah. I mean, if I'm an employer and I need someone to handle my Facebook marketing and some of my digital marketing stuff, someone with a Facebook certification for a startup or entry-level job would be pretty appealing to me.


Chad (17m 48s):

Why the hell not?


Joel (17m 49s):

Why the hell not? All right. Third on these ZipRecruiter in the last notable news from the week they've partnered with Comparably. So finally Zip takes aim at glass doors and Indeed strong hold on employee reviews announced earlier this month, ZipRecruiter has added new information to its employer pages, including anonymous employee reviews and typical salary ranges thanks to a new tie in with Glassdoor, wanna be Comparably. Founded in 2016, Comparably has raised $13.8 million in investment and in April, it boasted a database of 10 million ratings from employees across 60,000 North American companies.


Joel (18m 29s):

So should the review establishment be worried?


Chad (18m 33s):

Glassdoor's pretty much an Indeed zombie company, right? I mean, so this should be Comparably. The signal, the entire camp Comparably team should be focused on these types of integrations. This is all about data in signals. And if I say at once, I'll say it a million fucking times, this is a signal economy, but we're only going to get better signals if we're providing more relevant data to the actual end user.


Joel (19m 1s):

Yeah. So a lot of this is sort of a match that was destined to happen. Both these companies are based in Southern California, somewhere in LA. I don't know LA very well. So they are in each other's backyard. So the integration was sort of an obvious thing that was going to happen. Comparably needs to get acquired, I assume at some point. And what better acquisition partner than ZipRecruiter? The number two job site in the US so to me, this is like, this has acquisition written all over it. And this integration is just sort of part of the process, unless it really sucks. ZipRecruiter is going to write a check and just fold these guys into the business.


Joel (19m 43s):

I will caution everyone that Monster did this a few years ago with Kununu. You might remember that Kununu partnered with Monster, although their reviews were on Monster. It did not. It did not lead to Kununu being a huge player. It did not lead to Monster reinvigorating its business, in fact, the partnership I think, died a year or so ago, no more Kununu reviews. So it doesn't necessarily, it's not a layup that this is going to work. This may not, this may not work because Glassdoor's brand is still incredibly strong and Indeed's traffic is still incredibly robust.


Chad (20m 19s):

But Kununu is pretty much a site that nobody knew. Number one, they hooked up with the Titanic. I mean, Monster was dying. So, you know, ZipRecruiter's an entirely different brand, you know, does this make sense? I think from a Comparably standpoint, it just makes sense for them to do these types of partnerships, but ZipRecruiter shouldn't be the end of it. They should be integrating into applicant tracking systems to be able to provide more data to companies and job seekers, as they're coming in. I mean, there's so many different opportunities for enriched data, providing more signals and more engagement. Yep.


Joel (20m 57s):

And I think they are doing that to a certain degree. And I also think if ZipRecruiter wants to appeal to more enterprise level companies, like that's, who's on Comparably. It's not the corner pub, right? It's Facebook, it's IBM, it's Salesforce, large companies. So this is a way to sort of get a hook maybe into bigger companies that might not have paid attention. Now they're offering, you know, data and information on those companies so they're going to maybe take a call that they wouldn't have previously.


Chad (21m 26s):

Yeah. Will ZipRecruiter be able to execute on their enterprise strategy? That's the big question because all of their eggs were in the SMB basket and we saw how that affected them in early 2020.


Joel (21m 41s):

Yep. And also to reverse the script Comparably has stayed away from job postings on its site. It'll be interesting to see if ZipRecruiter postings start showing up on Comparably. So we'll look for that as well. All right. Let's take a quick break and we'll do some remote, rapid fire.


SFX (21m 60s):

break


Joel (22m 2s):

Remote, rapid fire. Chad, just a few weeks ago. Many managers were feeling confident enough to set plans, to ramp up operations again in the fall. Now the increasingly rapid resurgence of COVID-19 powered by the highly contagious Delta variant is prompting corporate leaders to rip up playbooks for the next few months. This is according to the Wall Street Journal. Here's a taste of the stories that dropped recently. We'll hit each one and have a quick comment and move to the next. Are you ready for remote rapid fire?


Chad (22m 36s):

Let's do it!


Joel (22m 37s):

All right. Let's start with an easy one. LinkedIn has announced that everyone can now work from home forever. Joining the likes of Twitter and Spotify. Comment.


Chad (22m 47s):

Okay. It's a layup. It's fairly simple. Number one, especially right now. And to say forever, I think is hilarious because you know, they're going to change this up within the next 12 months to 24 months, and they'll talk about the market and so on and so forth. So this is, I think, first off it's not true because it's not going to be forever for everybody. Although I think the press release is a layup.


Joel (23m 14s):

Yep. Is it just me, or does it feel like sort of these tier two tech companies are going remote forever or at least talking that game, whereas the top tier, your Apples, Facebook,. Googles are less or less likely to let that happen. It seems like there's the biggest of the bigger saying, get your ass back to work. We're the best place to work and you're going to come to the office, the tier two that are sort of struggling for those top, those top folks are saying remote forever to maybe get some of that, you know, secondhand smoke down into their offices.


Chad (23m 47s):

Agreed, agreed.


Joel (23m 49s):

Interesting. All right. Number two. WeWork is taking over abandoned brick and mortar. WeWork we'll open coworking spaces in Saks Fifth Avenue stores, one of your favorites, Chad, this is in the Wall Street Journal. The owner of Saks is hoping to make money from the rise of remote and hybrid work dubbed SAksWorks. New York, LA and other major cities are set to be, WeWorks next growth strategy. Comment.


Chad (24m 16s):

Can you say hail Mary?


Joel (24m 19s):

For her? Oh, for Sak's for Saks.


Chad (24m 21s):

I mean, I think WeWork is, is going to do, do pretty well. Right? As you talk about like the LinkedIn's of the world, they're going to want to have more flexible space. So WeWork is going to be a good option, but Saks has nothing to think more than to throw a hail Mary at this point.


Joel (24m 40s):

Yeah. The world has come to WeWork in a big way and it's just, it's just sort of landed in their lap, right? You're getting brick and mortar areas, which are good real estate, right? They're in good locations. These are gonna be WeWork stations and, you know, coffee shops and whatever for folks to come and work. This is probably going to go into companies that have to sublet office space that are no, no longer office spaces they're going to give it to WeWork. W what I think is funny is I think, I think Airbnb is fucking up. I think Airbnb and I predicted an Airbnb work product, I think in our January show. And I think we should be seeing stories like this from Airbnb. They should be integrated with some of these commercial real estate properties to have like Airbnb workstations and workplaces.


Joel (25m 24s):

It looks like WeWork as just on a field by itself right now. And they're getting a huge lead in this. So good for them. But I think, I think Airbnb is letting this opportunity pass.


Chad (25m 34s):

I think the company that we talk about that nobody's trying to mimic, and I don't understand if it's just not market validation or what have you is WorkChew. Can you go to a hotel, go to the Hilton downtown and have free coffee, discounts off of, you know, lunch, or what have you, and meet up with possibly people that you work with, partners, whatever you do, but have that, that work area. That's more of a community work area you're using space that somebody else already owns. Yeah.