Ep3 - Last Sourcer Standing w/ Amy Butchko

Welcome back to VOICES w/ Amy Butchko SAIC's Director of Talent Acquisition Solutions. This is episode 3 or a 5 part binge-able series. We pick up the conversation around building a Talent Solutions team from the ground up - enjoy!


- Building Teams

- Is AI sourcing the futrure?

- Overbuilt job descriptions

- Does social media drive hires?

TRANSCRIPTION SPONSORED BY: Disability Solutions partners with our clients to build best-in-class inclusion programs and reach qualified, talented individuals with disabilities of every skill, education, and experience level.

BINGE all 5 episodes with Amy

1 - The Struggle is Real

2 - Win Friends & Influence Budget

3 - Last Sourcer Standing

4 - Treat A.I. like a Puppy

5 - Moving Fast & Breaking Shit

Amy (0s):

If you're looking at high volume, simple, easy to scope roles, you don't need a sourcer for that. I mean, you can always do volume faster with machines.


Voices. We hear them every day. Some voices like mine are smooth and confident. While on the other hand, the Chad and cheese podcast is like listening to a Nickelback album. You rather stab yourself in the ears with an ice pick. Anyway, y'all now listening to voices, a podcast series from Chad and cheese that features the most important and influential voices within the recruitment industry. Try not to fuck it up, boys.

Chad (46s):

Welcome back to Voices with Amy Butchko, SAIC's Director of Talent Acquisition Solutions. This is episode three of a five part series. We pick up the conversation around building a talent solutions team from the ground up. Enjoy. Let's go ahead and start talking about how you actually build a team from the ground up because you were a team of one, right? And at that point, you know, what was your position at that point? And then, I mean, you've, you've made it to director, so, you know, you're still on your way up. Can you tell us that story a little bit?

Amy (1m 24s):

Well, yes I will. So I started as I was a principal recruiter for a long time and I thought, you know, I've got a good job. I love recruiting and I don't want to manage people, I know that for sure. So that was kind of where I was probably, you know, 10-15 years ago. And when I got to SAIC in 2013, in fact, they were looking for a director or someone to manage the sourcing operation. And I said, no, I'll work on the team. And I did. And eventually I ended up as the only sourcer or left. And they kind of put me in a role where I was now also in charge of the jobs to web system.

Amy (2m 6s):

And frankly, I think if I'm being completely honest, it was because I was the only person who had any patience with it at all and understood what it did. So, you know, so that may have actually made my whole career. And so, but ultimately, you know, I fell in love with the tech, that's what happened. And then what started to happen after that was I needed to scale. And in order to scale, I had to grow personally, you know, and learn how to build a team and to lead. And so getting to, you know, director, you know, I still think I have the best job at this company. Where I get to do creative things, I get to work with systems, I get to evaluate new technology I get to, and now I get to even make decisions about it.

Amy (2m 53s):

Wow! You know, that's like, you know, pinch me. So it's a great role. And it's also a great time to be in this business. I think that if it were 30 years ago, in this business, I don't know if I would have survived. I don't, I would, I'm not a yellow pages, Rolodex phone recruiter.

Joel (3m 13s):

It's interesting, our friends that Talk Push had a great blog post recently about how recruiting is moving from sort of what you mentioned, right, desk smiling and dialing, and becoming more of like the silent ninja profession where you know how to work databases and source candidates and use tech. And it sounds like that's your experience as well. You mentioned that you were the last sourcer standing, I'm just real curious. What are your thoughts on the future of sourcing as is it gonna all be automated? Will there still be really good ones employed? Will it go back to what it used to be before the pandemic? What are your thoughts on sourcing as a profession?

Amy (3m 52s):

Good question. I'm going to tell you my aspirational model. So I think that there is a place for automation. I think that there is a way, there's things that we're just not going to be able to not automate. Right? And eventually the technology will catch up and be intelligent enough, hopefully to be as smart as a person. Where I question if automation could completely do this work is, you know, most people I know don't like to talk to robots as much as they like to talk to people and as long as we're still employing people to do work, I think that the sourcing organization has a place. You know, cause if you look at the way, you know, and I think it might be worth even getting kind of boring for a second and figuring out like, what is a sourcer, compared to what is a recruiter?

Amy (4m 43s):

And you know, for me, it's about which parts of the process you're involved in. You know, so if you've had a recruiter, let's take that role because that's kind of the central one. You know, my, in my version of that, you know, that's a person who could manage a recruiting process from sourcing through onboarding.

Chad (5m 2s):

I see sourcing in itself is a function, the front end function before you actually can get into the recruiting aspect of it. I mean, you have to it's kind of like the research portion of research and development. Right?

Amy (5m 16s):


Joel (5m 16s):

But, they're not closing the deal I think in most cases. I think they're doing the finding, but they're not closing the deal.

Amy (5m 23s):

Right. I think that's right.

Joel (5m 24s):

So your point is, could the finding be automated or you're saying that no, there will have to be humans in sort of the scouring the web and looking at the every nook and cranny.

Amy (5m 34s):

Well, I think the tools aid drastically in the scouring of the internet, right? I mean, you know, the ability to write a Boolean search would, that was another thing that I was able to do really well back in the day, but now I wouldn't even need to know how to do that.

Chad (5m 49s):


Amy (5m 50s):

So, but I think here's the thing if you're looking at high volume, simple, easy to scope roles, you don't need a sourcer for that. You don't. I mean, you can always do volume faster with machines, than you can with people. It doesn't matter what it is, whether you're making hamburgers or you're filling jobs. It doesn't matter. Where things get interesting is where you have specialized roles, you know, your real knowledge workers, your real technical talent. All those folks are not cookie cutter finds.

Chad (6m 28s):

They're easier to identify though, aren't they?

Amy (6m 30s):

Not if they have a high security clearance.

Joel (6m 33s):

What percentage are on LinkedIn, that are employed by you guys?

Amy (6m 35s):

That is a good question. Probably about two thirds.

Joel (6m 39s):

Okay. I would have guessed more. So that's, that's all lower. So you had to find those folks in different way.

Amy (6m 44s):

You have to find those folks in different ways or Joel, if they're on LinkedIn and maybe their name is there, you would not have a way to identify what they do, without further enrichment of that data.

Chad (7m 0s):

Talking about enriching data, your database. I would assume that you have a very large and in charge database. And so again, we're talking about, in many cases, specialized talent pools, you probably already know most of, if not all the individuals that have those specialized skills that you want and/or need. How much of this is really around branding, trying to build relationships and pulling those individuals in and using your own database itself, as opposed to going out and spending money, trying to find these individuals?

Amy (7m 40s):

Yeah. So Chad, I see this as two questions. You know, the answer to your first part is about 80% of it, we can do through brand marketing our own database, about 80% of it.

Chad (7m 52s):


Amy (7m 52s):

And the rest of it, I think boils down to there are just, okay, so we're talking about the change in our world. Like our talent acquisition, TA tech, you know, what's happening in our world. The same thing is happening to every technical discipline, some of them even faster than our world. So what does that mean? What that means is let's say there's somebody that, you know, sure, maybe they've been in my database for 10 years. Maybe I have them as a unit systems administrator back in the day, what are they doing now? Not that.