This week was full of boycotts, layoffs and another million jobless claims, the boys discuss them all, as well as...
What the hell else do you want from us!?!?!
PODCAST TRANSCRIPTION sponsored by:
Hide your kids! Lock the doors! You're listening to HRS most dangerous podcast. Chad Sowash and Joel Cheesman are here to punch the recruiting industry, right where it hurts! Complete with breaking news, brash opinion and loads of snark, buckle up boys and girls, it's time for the Chad and Cheese podcast.
Dude I'm boycotting 2020, another million americans filed for unemployment last week, I'm Joel boycott Cheesman,
and I'm Chad "2020 Sucks" Sowash!
Yes it does. On this week's episode, indeed and glass door are down. Google for jobs is expanding and Karen makes her first appearance on the show.
This summer, Jobvite wants you, you and you! To join hundreds, thousands, millions! Okay? Maybe just thousands of recruiters, HR, and talent acquisition professionals for a summer you won't soon forget! It's Jobvite's Summer To Evolve. The Summer To Evolve is a 12 week series of free content to help recruiters brush up on their skills. Learn from industry thought leaders. And see how technology can help them improve, automate, and evolve their recruiting efforts. There will be a chance to share tips and ideas with your peers. And we may even have some surprises for you along the way. I love surprises.
JobVite (1m 6s):
So visit the summertoevolve.com to register for the summer toolbox sessions that suit your needs, peak your interest or float your boat. If you're just starting June 16th, it's the summer to evolve the way you attract, engage, hire, onboard, and retain talent, Jobvite recruit with purpose, hire with confidence.
Chad (2m 1s):
Only a couple of more weeks of the Summer to Evolve series but you can go back to the old seesions. So go to Summer to Evolve checkout I think Cheesman took a nap during his, I did one on onboarding. There's a bunch of good stuff out there.
Joel (2m 9s):
No they brought out the cattle prod for me and woke me up for that one. Yeah. The 12 week, the 12 weeks of of summerlove are coming to a close.
Chad (2m 18s):
Coming to a close
Joel (2m 19s):
So relive the magic, if you need to.
Chad (2m 20s):
Yeah. So trying to relive magic, I actually saw my Facebook feed that last year at this time I got up in the morning, ran with Henrik from JobSafari in Denmark in Copenhagen, we did a run. I met you in the Tengai crew in Torekov. That was so amazing. Great reminiscing. And then I remember that I'm in 2020, and this is a fucking shit show.
Joel (2m 48s):
Ah, the Scandinavian tour that was quite a lot of fun, I ate some real shitty fish while I was there. That's still coming up every now and then, that thing does not digest, but
Chad (3m 0s):
Chad and Cheese, want to make sure that the rest of 2020 is a little bit more bearable for our listeners. And I guess the first question Joel is is that Chad and Cheese in your pocket, are you just happy to see me?
Joel (3m 15s):
If there's vibration, don't come and knock and baby. So yeah, we are starting up text alerts cause you don't have enough of Chad and Cheese where we've partnered with emissary.ai to provide texts alerts for breaking news, exclusive content and who knows sexting may or may not occur. So open these things outside of work folks, you can text CC. That's the letter CC to (833) 799-0321.
Joel (3m 45s):
I'll say that again. Chad that's texts CC to eight three three seven nine nine Oh three, two one for Chad and Cheese in your pocket.
Chad (3m 54s):
And we also have free stuff. If you go to Chadcheese.com/free and register, you could possibly win a new brand, spanking new Chad and Cheese T-shirt brought to you by our friends again at emissary.ai. It's an entirely new design and we're going to send it right to your doorstep because the whole sort of social distancing thing, we can't bring it to you. So we're having somebody who's a professional do that.
Chad (4m 25s):
Also, you never know. We might even start sending birthday cards, holiday cards, beer, there's a ton of different promotions you could perspectively be a part of just by registering for free. So go to chadcheese.com click on free in the upper header or just chadcheese.com/free. Everybody loves free.
Joel (4m 46s):
Everybody loves free, man. Everybody loves free. And everybody's going to all of our shout outs this week, for sure. Ethan Bloomfield by far with a bullet goes to the top of the shout out list.
Joel (4m 59s):
My man, I don't know. I wanted to be on the show. We've been putting them off. So he's like, God damn it. I'm going to send some shit. So let's, let's break this down. Backpack, truckers, report hat, some sort of a notebook thingy. And then he really got serious and sent whiskey stones, whiskey sippers and a gift card to buy a bourbon or whiskey of our choice. So for that, Ethan,
Chad (5m 26s):
did you get yours yet?
Joel (5m 28s):
I have not. I will. By the time we, we have our little powwow with Ethan,
Chad (5m 33s):
I raced out to make sure that I got it obviously. And I've got stuff that I've been eyeing for a little while. It's called Horse Soldier. And I got the top shelf, the bourbon strength, which is like crazy. Yeah, it, it looks amazing. And now I got a chance to try it. Thanks, Ethan
Joel (5m 52s):
Buffalo Soldier, in the heart. Anyway, a shout to our buddy James Ellis and also Evergreen podcast cohort. My man's working at Roku, now, he announced that this week I have a Roku. I don't know about you, but love the product, hopefully he won't run it into the ground. Like he did Groupon and we'll see good things from, from James, James. You know, I can cause I love I kid cause I love.
Chad (6m 22s):
Well just go ahead and rebounding off that. We love lists and StoriesInc.com put us on a list called the best employer brand podcast ever. And here's the cool part. Evergreen podcast racked up four spots on the list. The talent cast with James Ellis, Recruiting Future with Matt Alder Crazy in the King with Julian Torn and the Chad and Cheese were listed as well.
Chad (6m 55s):
Top employer, brand podcasts, evergreen podcasts are kicking ass taking.
Joel (7m 1s):
We own this bitch. We own this bitch. Shout out to Denise VanderLawns. Hopefully I'm saying that right. She's out of the Netherlands and you know exactly where that is on the map, right? She's she's in the biz dev department at, at worth, at or worth and, and to talent.edu. She's a new listener and a big fan. Shout out to you, Denise.
Chad (7m 24s):
Good shout out to Sarah Elkins who just joined the staff over at Shaker as their new VP of digital good hire there, Joe. Good, good one buddy. Also, I got to throw this out there. We're going to be unveiling a new website design, also Shaker Recruitment Marketing our travel sponsor, which you know, this is what our travel has been thus far is helping us pull that together.
Chad (7m 54s):
We're pretty excited. We had our first call yesterday. I have a project manager, a team. These people are taking this shit serious.
Joel (8m 3s):
And we may have to say goodbye to the I blindingly yellow site that we currently have. So if you love the yellow, get it, get it out of your system now. Cause we're going professional in this motherfucker. Shout out to, iCIMS for raising the game on their speakers this year, they're bringing Mindy Kayling and Trevor Noah who are famous Hollywood types to their November 17th and 18th event. I believe it's free to sign up.
Joel (8m 33s):
You can correct me if I'm wrong on that, but find out more at icims.com. If you want to see Mindy and Trevor probably make some jokes and tell some insightful shit
Chad (8m 43s):
And then Cornerstone Counters with their on demand events, Viola Davis, Adam Grant, Emmanuel Ocho, the guy who's like has the uncomfortable conversations with the black man that dude Curtis stone, the like kick ass chef. I don't know what he's going to be talking about, but yeah, so iCIMS and Cornerstone bringing the heat to digital events this year. That's fucking awesome.
Joel (9m 12s):
Very nice. Very nice. So I'm going to give a shout out to just sports, real quick. I'm sure you know about the Milwaukee Bucks boycotted their game yesterday, the playoff game, the rest of the MBA followed suit baseball, baseball followed suit the NBA followed suit and had, I guess some, some ceremonies that were really powerful. They had one of the teams had tee shirts with bullet holes in the back representing the police violence that happened in Kenosha of all places.
Joel (9m 47s):
Jesus. So shout out to sports. They continue to be a voice where government tends to be silent in too many cases or too stupid in most cases and shout out to, to them.
Chad (10m 0s):
The NBA and WNBA have taken a huge lead on this. If you've seen their jerseys black lives matter. I mean, it is the central part of every single game. You can see it everywhere. So they are leading and we'll see what Roger Goodell and the NFL does because they usually take a shit on anything that matters.
Joel (10m 23s):
Yeah. Football was oddly quiet during all of this. Even some of the players that they interviewed were not doing a lot of talking. It was sort of like, our season hasn't started yet. We'll we'll cross those bridges when we get to it.
Chad (10m 35s):
Yeah and in thinking about Cap and taking a knee, that was again on the sideline, it was something that he was doing and some of the others did this. He didn't stop the damn game. These guys are taking it to the next level. But again, Everett, that all started with Cap.
Joel (10m 53s):
It did, it did. are we traveling any, any events for you in the future?
Chad (10m 57s):
Yeah. I've got one today that we're finishing off the recruitmenthackers.events. We're going to be talking. I think there's going to be an on demand afterwards. So check it out again. Recruitment or recruitmenthackers.events. We're gonna talk about go figure: remote work. What does that look like now? What does it look like in the future? How's it impacting companies today and the scalability of tomorrow. Topics!
Joel (11m 25s):
And with that! Yeah. So the news Recruit Holdings reported revenue fell by 20% and its fiscal first quarter ending in June 30th, amid COVID-19 obviously, the Tokyo based global staffing firm reported revenue fell across all business lines, including our buddies at Indeed and Glassdoor due to the impact of the pandemic. The company noted that some question, whether job secret traffic on Indeed and Glassdoor should have increased instead of decreasing, Chad.
Joel (11m 57s):
And because of the high unemployment rate, when in fact there was an initial decline, recruit, cited several factors for the decline, including many job seekers were reluctant to search for new jobs and go to work because of health concerns. And as well, they cited changing jobs. Workers may be receiving unemployment benefits that would discourage them from looking for new jobs. Your thoughts,
Chad (12m 22s):
Apparently their Japan staffing saw arise near 6%. And we take a look at how Japan really took COVID seriously and how, you know, we here in the United States didn't and how we are impacting global economies, overall. And that's what, you know, that's what being a part of a global economy's like, but when you have one of the, the super powers economic powers do stupid shit like we have, this is what's going to happen.
Chad (12m 54s):
I think those are, those are great indicators to look, look at Japan had a rise. Everything else had a fall when it comes to traffic and job search traffic. I think we saw that across the board job seekers and really just human beings are unsure what the fuck is going on in the first place. And they don't feel safe going to work. It's hard. And you know, it's interesting how we here in the US dealt with things.
Chad (13m 26s):
We gave money to companies and we also gave money to people, but we gave money to companies and now we're just sitting around and hoping that everything goes away. Now that the money's run out. So from an economic standpoint, how is this going to get any better?
Joel (13m 42s):
So you know it really helps with job seeker, traffic, job postings. If there aren't any postings, traffic tends to take a dip. However, I do think that with tens of millions of people being unemployed, that, that you, you it's, it's hard to not see some sort of an increase in traffic at job boards. And my own little, my little theory on this is that I've always felt like brand loyalty to job boards is a myth. I really don't think people by and large give a shit whether it's Indeed or Monster, whoever.
Joel (14m 13s):
And I think that the, the, the behavior of what a person is, Oh crap, I'm unemployed. What do I do? I need to find a job. Well, what do I need? What do I do when I typically have to find something, I go to this thing called the Google machine. And at the Google machine, I searched for jobs. And there's a lot of people that had no clue about Google for Jobs six months ago. Now suddenly find out that, Oh shit, Google has job postings now. And I'm going to search postings on Google now, and guess who doesn't play with Google, Indeed.
Joel (14m 45s):
So if you have tens of millions of new people looking for jobs, they're probably going to Google cause there's no brand to Indeed. And they see these jobs on Google and they're not, Indeed's not playing. So guess what? Traffic's going to go down to. Indeed. Glassdoor does though. Okay. So that goes back to my, you have to have job postings to have traffic. Yeah. So I mean, my point is simply that I don't, you know, I think that people are learning, like learning that OSHA. Google's where I searched for everything.
Joel (15m 16s):
Now they have jobs and I, and this whole, this will segue nicely into our next story in that Google is expanding, but I'll save that for, for after this topic.
Chad (15m 27s):
No, I think we write it right into the, the, the next topic, which is Google for Jobs is launching in the Netherlands. And I love the whole spin that you've taken is that look, people are searching, but we've talked about this before. Google is a lifestyle platform, Android, Google search. I mean, they own search for, for most of the world, so therefore if I start searching, as you'd said before, then the organic isn't going to be there, especially on my mobile phone, the Google for jobs is going to be there and then that just becomes my new routine.
Chad (16m 2s):
Right. And then we also talked about bingo, India Kormo last week where, you know, they actually are going to have an app dedicated to jobs in, in India. So yeah, I like the spin on that. And from the standpoint of the Netherlands and everywhere else in the world, if you do have jobs and you're in the organic, which is below Google for Jobs, you're already hindered. But if you don't have as much content as that, as you had before, and obviously that's a double whammy.
Joel (16m 37s):
Yeah. And I also think that that job seekers are, are maturing, right? Th they understand that there's this thing called LinkedIn, where they can connect to people and try to get in zip companies and search for jobs. So I haven't seen numbers, but I wouldn't, I wouldn't be surprised if LinkedIn traffic has gone through the roof in the pandemic, as people update their profiles and try to network and connect to people and whatnot. So Google is good a lot at a lot of things. And they're really, really good at seeing trends in their searches and seeing where traffic is spiking and where there's activity.
Joel (17m 12s):
And there's no doubt in my mind that some engineer at Google said, Holy shit, job searches are through the roof. And then someone said, okay, we need to expand this Google for Jobs thing as quickly and as extremely as we can. Obviously Europe, there's a lot of minds that they have to Dodge with GDPR and antitrust stuff. So I think it's just a matter of time, but you're going to see Google for jobs. I think start growing at an expedited at expedited pace.
Joel (17m 43s):
I reached out to our good buddy, Vencat at a Jobyak this week and ask him about sort of the opening of the Netherlands and Belgium. So his quote was, the timing is appropriate. As the pandemic has created an unheard of unemployment crisis, nearly 40 million plus in the U S alone. And Google continues to play a substantial role in mitigating it, which further substantiates its seriousness, the seriousness of its role in the recruiting market, his clients, he says, are seeing anywhere between two and four times the number of applications that they normally see and conversions resulting in a reduction of up to 70% in their hiring costs.
Joel (18m 26s):
So in addition to more job seekers, sort of discovering Google, according to him, more employers are discovering Google and the cost reductions and the efficiencies that come with getting traffic from Google, as opposed to the job board of your choice.
Chad (18m 44s):
I hope we start to see a pivot to definitely focusing on how do I invest in getting better search results for my jobs. And also focusing on the Programmatic aspect of targeting instead of just throwing out dumb jobs and spraying them to, to everywhere in anywhere, we've got enough data where we can target the right types of individuals with those jobs. So stop just, just doing the spraying and praying and start looking at obviously a search, you know, optimizing for Google and Programattic
Joel (19m 19s):
Yep. And apparently they're going to be a lot more job seekers out there after a week of mass layoffs. For those of us in the industry, Hiring Solved recently had around layoffs. If you haven't heard that shred, I invite you to do so as well.B ut we have some reporting out of Randstart RiseSmart this week, quote, among employers that made furloughs or layoffs because of the bit of the pandemic, 47% are considering further workforce reductions in the next 12 months.
Joel (19m 53s):
This is according to a survey of 250 HR professionals. It also found that 9.3% of employers have laid off workers because of COVID and 11.3% have furloughed workers. In addition, I thought this was most interesting 47.2% have not made any new hires since the pandemic was declared a national emergency. So that's people that aren't posting jobs. Again, a quote from Dan Davenport, president and GM at RandSmart RiseSmart quote wallet is a positive sign that the unemployment rate is starting to decrease.
Joel (20m 27s):
We are still in the midst of this pandemic and based on our survey results, more Corona virus related layoffs could be in the horizon. Don't like that.
Chad (20m 38s):
We, we, when we said this, I think it was probably six months ago until this health issue is taken care of until we start to actually wear masks and really start to socially distance and look at remote work. This is going to be around because we're not going to find any type of quote, unquote antidote to COVID-19 overnight. It's not going to happen. It's generally 12 to 18 months.
Chad (21m 8s):
So right now we're feeling the pain of our stupidity over the last six months, this is happening again. What thinking about Japan and South Korea, this is happening because we are quote unquote rebels and we don't have to wear a fucking mask and we don't have to do these things because of liberty and justice. The Liberty and justice allows us to think about not just ourselves, but our community and how to safeguard our family and all of those around us.
Chad (21m 39s):
Unfortunately, this rugged individualism known as America is fucking us pretty hard.
Joel (21m 45s):
We don't need no stinking badges. Yeah. So you have this perfect storm of people coming off unemployment, which was July. I think it was the end of that. And they still have yet to come up with a, with a renewal of, of helping those folks. And then we have the second wave of that is that I believe the, the, the, the loans that were given initially, you were required to keep people on staff, right until August. So we've hit this point of like, okay, everyone that's been assisted is off of that. And all the companies that were assisted canal, lay out, lay everybody off.
Joel (22m 16s):
So we've seen like mass layoffs this week from, from Salesforce, which also hits us here in Indy. The biggest building here has Salesforce on it and reports out there say that Exact Target, which was the acquisition Salesforce made is getting hit the hardest so that could hit us pretty hard here, here, locally. Wells Fargo, American Airlines, NetApp, even the pack 12, the Arizona coyotes like layoffs are everywhere this week and it's only gonna get worse as companies sort of get the green light to start laying people off again from the government.
Chad (22m 50s):
As we don't deal with this healthcare crisis.
Joel (22m 53s):
Let's hear an ad from Sovren collect ourselves and maybe talk about some more interesting different topics. Shot of bourbon.
Sovren (23m 2s):
Sovren Parser is the most accurate resume and job order intake technology in the industry, the more accurate your data, the better decisions you can make. Find out more about our suite of products today by visiting sovren.com, that's S O V R E N.com. We provide technology that thinks, communicates and collaborates like a human. Sovren ~ Software so human you'll want to take it to dinner.
Joel (23m 30s):
Where'd you graduate Google?
Chad (23m 32s):
Google bitches. Again yet, I've been railing on companies. I don't know for how long about this next story in Inc Magazine about this story?
A long time
Chad (23m 44s):
It's actually a couple of articles in Inc Magazine Google made waves recently recently by announcing it's new program, Google Career Certificates, a collection of courses designed to help participants get qualifications and high paying high growth job fields without attending university, a company is actually taking the lead. And they're trying to, I mean, if you think of it overall, they are trying to close their skill gap themselves.
Chad (24m 18s):
But in this case, they also have companies like Walmart, Intel, Sprint, Bank of America, PNC, Best Buy, H&R Block, Hulu, Emphasis, Sam's Club. And the list keeps growing. They're all a part of this as wel so Google again, taking the lead where Universities are falling the fuck down.
Joel (24m 41s):
No doubt. You know, I think this is a trend that we're going to continue to see. I think that there's a growing importance in terms of certificates and people just being skilled in certain areas, right? And let's, let's be honest, like college isn't for everyone, but not everyone wants to, you know, to join the military or join trucking, or like there's gotta be a third rail for folks that either don't have the money don't want to pay the money, don't want to spend four years before they actually start working that they can funnel into a privatized basically road where they pay minimal amount they're employed in six months, they're in, they learn skills that are in demand and they can continue to learn skills as they, as they continue to, to grow their career.
Joel (25m 29s):
I think this impacts, I don't know the impact on colleges. You know, I think there's still going to be this elitist opinion about degrees that you have. I think certain colleges, if you don't have that premier degree, is that less demand because why, you know, why get a, why get a degree from XYZ college when I could just go get a certificate for a fraction of the cost and be employed in six months? So I assume more and more companies will follow suit.
Joel (25m 59s):
I think the Intel's of the world, the Qualcomms, the Microsofts, et cetera, will have similar courses like Google. Also in the news this past week or last week late was Lambda school, a startup that offers online computer science classes to be paid when a student gets a job, a raise 74 million in funding. And this was, I think their series C. So they raised well over a hundred million dollars, in doing this. And you're seeing colleges like Purdue here locally have systems where if you get an engineering degree or going to engineering college, you don't have to pay them until you actually get a job.
Joel (26m 39s):
And then they take a percentage of your earnings. So college is even on the traditional level are having to get real creative around how they, how they collect money and get students in the door. And we're also seeing private organizations like Lambda school come around and have a similar model. So education more than anything. And I think COVID is, is accelerating how all this stuff is changing is one of the more interesting things to watch and how it shakes out. I don't know, but it's going to be fun to watch. And I like to think that we'll have a lot smarter people, more skilled people that aren't in this abysmal hole of debt, their entire life.
Joel (27m 17s):
Cause that is something that is not helpful to society.
Chad (27m 21s):
Yeah, Yeah. And with COVID, you know, obviously I have two in college now I'm, you know, doing hybrid classes, it's going to be the delivery of the content. And I am still a huge proponent in the military format of you go to college, like, this is what ROTC does. You go to college, you get your degree and you sign on the dotted line and you come work for us for four to six, or who knows how many years, but you're on contract to work for us and we will pay for that degree.
Chad (27m 55s):
I believe corporate America should be paying the freight because the people that are actually making the products and providing the services, the ones that they really, really need and want right now, that's how you get them through the door. That's how you make them loyal. And so I, I agree with what you're talking about, about being able to evolve. But I think the major evolution here is a company like a Google or an Emphasis, or whoever it might be saying, look, we're going to pay for your degree, come work for us.
Joel (28m 27s):
Sure and let's be honest, if we keep building walls around borders and making it harder to come into this country, there's going to be more demand to sort of grow our own and get these engineering spots filled in one way or another. And if it's Google educating everybody, then Google's gonna educate everybody.
Chad (28m 44s):
Well. And if you think about it now, the H1B visas, and some of the, the student visas, right. That are, that are not allowed. That's where colleges make their money, because those kids pay full freight. There's no discount for them to come and get an education. But if you can't, that revenue is not there for a university. So we're going to see some, we're going to see some thinning out of the academia, let's say.
Joel (29m 14s):
Yep. Yep. It'll be interesting. So you mentioned the military, you loved this story about AI versus fighter pilots in the air force. What was that about?
Chad (29m 23s):
Fucking DARPA dude, we've talked about AI and we've talked about where we can see AI and who's going to be using it first. And we talk about this all the time, the fucking military. They will do the best job in being able in a practical sense, use AI. And in this case, this is out of business insider, a US Air Force F16 pilot, just battled AI in five simulated dog fights and the machine emerged victorious every single time.
Chad (29m 59s):
And AI program developed by Heron Systems, went head to head against a seasoned air force F 16 pilot. The guy is actually an instructor and it was like a simulated World War II dog fight, which again, from a maneuverability standpoint, it's gotta be the hardest. An expert commentator over at DARPA said that the AI algorithm demonstrated superhuman aiming ability during the dog fight. And then during the fight, the pilot never scored a single hit.
Chad (30m 31s):
The human zero machine kicked their ass.
Joel (30m 37s):
It's interesting that not only, I would, I'm not surprised that the AI was a better offensive opponent. The fact that it was a better defensive opponent sort of surprises me. I don't know your take on that, but it's, it's pretty clear that technology is taking over much of the military and will be more and more. Which I think it's, it's a nice segue to reverse here back on, you know, people that don't want to go to college, but still want to get, have a good career. I think the automation of the military is gonna force a lot of folks that would normally go into the military, get a certificate from Google or another academic institution agree, disagree, or, or we're going to find other places for the military folks?
Chad (31m 20s):
No, I mean, there's, there's no question. So some of, some of the best jobs you go into the air force Navy, or what have you, that you can get to transition back into the, into the civilian populations in the military, you have to have secret top secret clearances. I mean, these are, this tech is fucking crazy, but in this case, there's got to be a line in which we step up and say, look, we can't have robots fighting wars for us.
Joel (31m 50s):
How do you stop it though? Really?
Chad (31m 53s):
There has to be regulation. That's all there. I mean, that's it, there has to be regulation. And then you have to work again with other countries to be able to band together, to make sure that this is not happening. But think about it, I mean, look at drones today, they are ridiculous. Right? Think of being able to put this type of technology in drones, that aren't the size of an F 16, but let's say a quarter of the size, or maybe even smaller than that and sending them out in swarms.
Chad (32m 24s):
I mean, this is just ridiculous what we can do. And as human beings, I'm not saying that the machines will take over, but once we, as human beings have too much power, we see how that happens.
Joel (32m 37s):
Yeah. So you, you